Credit Resolution Advisors – Scam, Complaint, Review, or Praise?

Please share your experience with this debt relief company and provide your review and feedback, in the comments section below.

The goal of this page is to allow people to share information that may be important to help others to make a more informed decision regarding their experience with this debt relief company. Here are some potential questions you might be able to provide feedback about.

  • How did you feel about the customer service experience you received?
  • Was the company easy to communicate with before or after you became a client?
  • Did the company respond to your communications promptly?
  • What were the fees charged for the services you received?
  • Did the company give you the terms and conditions for the program you were interested in before you gave them any personal information?
  • Was the program successful for you and accomplish the goals you had when you entered the program?
  • Did you have a really good experience you can share?
  • Did you have a bad experience you want to share?
  • Is there any other information you’d like people to know that might be considering the services of this company?

It is important to understand when reading comments below that they are the opinions of the individual posters and may not be representative of the overall impression of all consumers that may have or have not used the debt relief services of this company. But everyone does deserve to have an opportunity to express their opinion, even the debt relief company itself, be it good, bad, or indifferent.

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See also  Credit Resolution Advisors - CRA - Consumer Complaint - 9-12-2012

186 thoughts on “Credit Resolution Advisors – Scam, Complaint, Review, or Praise?”

  1. Credit Resolution Advisors is a scam.I was enrolled in their program,and convinced that they will negotiate my two credit account,with 30 months payments of $435.00 a month.After the 30 months payment is done,they send me a message that I have to continue paying until the 2nd account is settled.I regretted,believing what they offered is true.


  2. STOP! If you are thinking about working with CreditResolution Advisors, be prepared to give your money away to the most shady, underhanded, deceptive, SCAMS that was ever created. This company will sale you on their product, erase thousands of dollars of debt with a smile. The truth is they will leave you in worse shape than you were at the beginning of your initial contact. They are members of the BBB nor do the follow guidelines of the BBB. This was told to me by their own customer service representative (Amber). If you are in serious debt, call your creditors your self and work out a plan, you will better success than dealing with a debt consolidation or resolution company. Don’t throw money at a company that can not deliver what they promise, throw your money at the people you owe.

  3. Stay away from Credit Resolution Advisors. They do not follow the law — first, they collect their fees and would not answer questions once I signed up. They avoided providing direct response on how they would handle creditors and negotiations. All they said was — if creditors call, do not answer phone. Watch out — agreement states you only have 10 days to get refund if you decide to discontinue program. Stupid — how can you make good assessment on results when they tell you time and time again to be patient with process. Two months later, when they refuse to provide direct answers and creditors are calling every day — that is when you know something is wrong. I have filed complaints with FTC, BBB and Texas State Attorney General. I really hope to get my money back. These people are deceptive and dishonest. I asked about BBB rating (F) and they claimed businesses buy good ratings through BBB membership. As if I would buy that! Again, stay away and avoid yourself a nightmare.

  4. I got roped in also after having a stroke and not being able to pay my bills. I have made contact with the bank and can recover some of my money. I also sent CRA two emails and am planning to check into legal action since they pulled $$$ from my account. This so called company also ripped a friend of mine off and he is over 75 years old, never had money problems before seeking CRA’s help and is now in worse shape because of them. Shame on this Company. It is sad if our country lets this scam go on. They should go to jail…..

  5. Please note that most of these posts are from people who know they are being scammed. There are a few from individuals who seem too angry at the negative posts. The fact is, there are many people who have had very negative experiences or are very wary of this company’s suspicious behavior. What it looks like, and I suspect is an accurate assumption, is that occasionally a representative or officer within CRA monitors websites like this one and throws in an angry response. The few derogatory responses of the pro-CRA posters on this thread are far too aggressive and seem to be taking the “scam” accusation too personal for them to be casual visitors.

    The simple truth is that if you have done any one of the following things – are listed on the National No Call Registry, have told these companies to take your number off thier lists, requested they do not contact you by mail, email or any other form – they are legally required to leave you alone. If they do not the are breaking the law. Forward all mail you receive to the FTC, BBB, and anyone else you might know that would conduct an investigation.

    My personal experience with this company has envolved unwanted mail/emails, harrasing phone calls, abusive language from “representatives”, and having my personal phone number given out by these “representatives” to other customers as the complaint line. I am on the National No Call list, I have told them to take me off thier call list, and written a letter to cease and desist. It didn’t work. I am currently involved in filing a lawsuit against them.

    You might think that I somehow used thier services and decided I wasn’t happy, deciding to spurn them to get even. But I have never asked for thier solicitation, needed thier services, or given them any indication that I was interested in what they have to offer.

    The choice whether to use this company is yours. I advise against it, as do most of the people here. But ultimately, you must use common sense.

  6. Curiously, after ignoring many requests from CRA, I stopped getting mail from them — but started getting IDENTICAL mailings from “ADM” (American Debt Mediators”, 15950 North Dallas Pkwy Ste 400, Dallas, TX 75428. The name is in the very fine print at the bottom, but “ADM” is in big, bold letters at the top. I can’t say for sure, but perhaps they want to be mis-identified with Archer Daniels Midland (also “ADM”), also in Dallas. A Google search for “American Debt Mediators” was inconclusive. A nondescript site showing a “Chris Elliott” as manager of ADM. LLC.

  7. I called this company’s 800 number because of the letter that looked like a collection letter with red inside. I have friends in PO. I asked them to take me off their list two or three weeks ago. I asked the guy who answered why was this coming to me anyway. He looked up my reference number on the paper and said “Sir, you haven’t been paying down your credit cards.” What! What business is it of this company where I decide to put my money? I paid thousands toward my wife’s stay in the hospital those recent months instead of my cards being paid down. Talk about an invasion of privacy! I got another letter today with “Final Notice” on the front of the envelope. Called back again today to tell them I must still be on their list. One guy hung up on me. The second call I made a woman answered, and when I tried to tell her, she said they do not have any personal information on people….just general stuff. Then she proceeded to act like a juvenile talking over me while I tried to tell her what happened to me and why I resented still getting their trash. Finally she hung up on me while wishing me a good day! What jerks!!!! In my opinion!

    • I forgot to mention that I haven’t had a delinquency in years on anything I pay and usually pay early. This is what pissed me off so much about this company…any especially when the woman today basically acted like a child with their fingers in their ears while being spoken to.

  8. Enough with this company! They made me second guess if I had any outstanding bills I may have forgotten about and I am an intelligent well financially organized person. I can imagine how many people are frightened into calling these people especially after hurricane Sandy turned people’s life into emotional and financial turmoil. SHAME ON THEM! May they never have a good night’s sleep in their warm beds with clean sheets and the night light burning so they may find their way to the bathroom that actually flushes! SHAME, SHAME SHAME on the scare tactics!

  9. They sent me a mailer from Plano, TX which at first glance looked like a debt collection notice but upon second glance was basically some BS telling me that for $335 they could negotiate a settlement with all of my creditors for half of my estimated creditor balances. The fact that they ask for a sign-up/advance fee is a total red flag that this is a scam. I threw it directly in the garbage after calling them and telling me to take them off their mailing list. It worries me that these fools haven’t been shut down yet.

  10. I live in a small town where everyone knows everything. I got a mailer from these people about a month ago. I reviewed it, determined they were phishing for business and shredded it.

    Today I went to the PO to get my mail and my box had what appeared to be a delinquency notice–plain envelope, pink insert. I went ballistic. I called them. They actually argued with me on the phone. They got my name from my creditors. I said, really? No kidding. I said funny because your letter clearly states in the fine print you are not a creditor or a debt collector. How did you manage that?

    Long story short, I have my credit monitored. I know exactly what is in my credit report and my credit score. I told the woman on the phone if they did not cease and desist I would hire a lawyer and sue them for defamation of character. She said they’d remove me from the list.

    She was snotty, unprofessional, and pushy and most clearly lying.

    Steer clear of these creeps.They are nothing but a scam.

  11. Absolute SCAM. Received 2 letters claiming we’re in debt for “15,000” which is obviously just some weird guess by a company that wants to make money off people’s fear. All of our accounts are in order, so we wouldn’t need remediation, or credit counseling. If we did, I would go to a an actual service where I live, not use some weird company in Plano Texas (last month they were headquartered out of Northern California…until I notified the PO Box company they were renting from and let them know that RACKETEERING is a FEDERAL OFFENSE.) Threatening letters about bogus debt is illegal. Don’t be fooled by the con artists who comment here with their “positive” reviews of this shady scam company. They are STEALING MONEY FROM PEOPLE. It’s a CON. Wake up people. Some company with constantly changing phone numbers and addresses contacts you to “help” you with your “debts” without any specifics? If they were a REAL COLLECTION AGENCY they would have the information on your account that was past due. If they were a real credit counseling service they wouldn’t MAKE UP FALSE INFORMATION AND SEND IT TO YOU, now would they? Be smart. Don’t fall for this LAME SCAM.

  12. Dang. I was just told I owe 15000. I think when I brought my house 3 yrs ago that would have popped up on my credit report. Which might I say is great

  13. This is a complete scam! It really made me upset! I have worked very hard on correcting my credit and score, so much so that years ago I signed up for a credit protection and reporting agency. I got this very official letter from CRA claiming to assist in facilitate a settlement offers to my creditors. Even providing an official Reference #, I logged into my credit reporting service and ran a current and up to date report. With my report coming back with a score of 829 and totally clean report with no blemishes. What a relief but that really pissed me off that they are misleading consumers with good or bad credit! And Wow what does this say for this companies Scruples!!! They are common Thieves or scumbag con artists!!

  14. I called these guys, found out what they’re about, and asked them NOT to contact me again. The very next month they sent me another letter which makes it look like I owe someone money and they are trying to collect. I am reporting these guys to any and everyone I can. TOTAL SCAM!

  15. A very elderly person who is part of my church, was so happy when she received the letter promising to help her to clear her debts, since she does not have any family living with her she brought it to me for an advise, I was looking all over the Internet for Credit Relief Advocates 5700 Granite Pkwy, Suite 200 Plano Tx 75024 1-800-900-9208 but i could not find any information at all just Credit Resolution Advisors, so i called them today 10/08/12 and asked them if it was Credit Resolutions and they said yes, so basically they changed name again just to continue deceiving people and they said on the phone they have been there for over 10 years, it is time to stop. Ahart04.Get Out of Debt (http://s.tt/1gvB4)

  16. I very elderly person that is part of my church was so happy when she received the letter promising to help her to clear her debts, since she does not have any family living with her she brought it to me for an advise, I was looking all over the Internet for Credit Relief Advocates 5700 Granite Pkwy, Suite 200 Plano Tx 75024 1-800-900-9208 but i could not find any information at all just Credit Resolution Advisors, so i called them and asked them if it was Credit Resolutions and they said yes, so basically they changed name again just to continue deceiving people and they said on the phone they have been there for over 10 years it is time to stop. Aham4 or whatever your name was.

    • Man…I’m glad I read this. So shady. Never had any problems then I get 2 mail the same day? If people have any sense, they’ll see this is scam. I don’t even think they would help anyone. Seems to me like a bogus nonexistent charge that they want to “help you manage”. Looks like a buncha thieves to me.

  17. A friend of mine who knew that I had enrolled in a debt settlement plan recently asked me about my experience.  I told him about CRV in Plano, Tx and what to expect.  He later called me and told me that he was leary due to all of the things he read online.  After reading these comments myself, I thought I should post a comment too.  I enrolled about 3 years ago after years of struggling with debt and getting nowhere because of the interest charges. I was actually able to finish my program a few months early because I paid a little extra once in a while.  All of my accounts were settled just as they said they would be and I saved over $10,000.  I am disappointed in the people who feel the need to post nasty comments about something that either they personally don’t understand or need.  If you get a piece of mail you dont need, throw it away! Some people who could definitely benefit from programs like this will not get the help they need because all they read is negative and no positive.  Getting out of debt is not magic and it does take a little time and patience but was it worth saving $10,000 over 3 years to me? YES!  Was my credit affected, Yes, but once I had the debt settled, I actually saw my credit score go higher than it was before I started because once I got rid of the high montly credit card payments and all of the balances, I actually could manage my expenses and my DTI was no longer out of balance.  I hope other people with positive outcomes will also post. 

    • Hey Kim,

      It is great that it worked out for you. The main issue is not so much the mailer, although it is deceptive and annoying, but it is the purpose behind the mailer. This company has sales people trained to convince people to sign up into the program. This is not a good solution for everyone that calls in but the sales people sell it anyway, that is their job.

      So while it may work out for you, it isn’t going to work out for others. So my major problem is their deceptive advertising practices, that lead to a sales person pretending to know how to resolve a consumers debt issue.

  18. ok so i am a previous client of their debt mediation service, the rep. i spoke to was polite and helpful, explained to me why i received the letter, and then explained to me the programs they had to offer. They told me everything up front and with full disclosure, yes i was upset about the letter but after it was explained to me i took some time to think about it, and gave it a shot. They gave me everything in writing and where extremely helpful throughout the duration of my 30 month program. I actually ended up saving even more than what they had told me and was able to graduate and pay off in 26 months 0 balances on my credit report and all. Being that i was in a tough situation due to our bad economics time making minimums it would have taken me 30 years to pay off my debt on my own and i am extremely great full that there are program like this designed to help us when these banks are just ruthless. All of you who are afraid because of some f BBB rating are ignorant, not only is the BBB a pay for play organization where you have to pay for an A rating to be a member, but also are being sued by attorney generals for it. On top of all that the BBB gives places like STAR BUCKS where we all get our coffee an f rating yet award HAMAS with an A rating which is an organization that funds terrorist organizations such as AL-Queida, all you googlers and researchers should look into that before posting bogus reviews.

    Credit resolution ad visors saved my finances and spared me the trials and tribulations of Bankrupcy! I wish more people who actually knew what they where talking about gave them a chance rather than posting bad reviews and filing complaints because they are angry about some letter they got.

    • Hmm, not saying I don’t believe you, but it seems strange that 3 overly positive comments in a row just appeared at the same time. And don’t take this the wrong way, but your rant on the BBB is taken right out of the debt settlement sales persons handbook.

  19. These folks are a scam. They are going after people with good credit and trying to convince them that they are better off doing a settlement. The problem with this is that it WILL ruin your credit.

    I got a letter from them and called them on the off chance that someone had opened an account in my name. That wasn’t the case at all. The moron on the other end of the phone actually tried to sell me on making a settlement offer on accounts which are current, of which all of mine are.

    When I told him that this would ruin my credit he just changed the subject and started to talk about hardships people are having.

    Somehow they are obtaining credit balances of people with excellent credit and their contact information. I believe this use is a violation of agreement with the credit reporting agencies, but not completely sure.

    They want to make a profit and will destroy your credit to do it.

  20. I’ve got perfect credit and carry large balances from time to time but pay them off montly.  There is no reason for them to contact me.   A total Scam. Their letter says they can cut what I owe in1/2.  I pay my bills in full thank you.  NO need to send this to perfect credit consumers who pay their full bills on a monthly basis.  A total Joke!  Do not use this services. Where in the world did they even get my name?  And what stupid list am I on that they would even insult me with this.

  21. Every credit resolution advisor organization does exactly the same thing you can do for yourself.  The major difference is that they charge you for what you can do for free simply by calling your creditor(s).  

    My mother continually receives junk mail from CRA … why?  She owes nobody any money; no mortgage, no car, no credit card balance, etc., yet, at least once a week a letter from CRA comes in the mail.

    Folks … don’t open the letter.  Write on the envelope to RETURN TO SENDER, ADDRESSEE UNKNOWN and drop it in the mailbox.  

  22. SCAM!  SCAM! SCAM!  
    This is a total scam.  I have no debt but received a mailing indicating it was a second notice telling me that I haf a debt of $27K that I could resolve for $15K, but they needed a payment of $477 immediately to qualify.

    Tear these notices up immediately and do not respond.  I am reporting this company to the better business bureau. 

    This is just a scams!  Be careful!

  23. I just received a pink letter from CRA claiming that they had sent a catalog.. Perhaps they did and I threw it away???  Out of curiosity I called just to ask some questions. The man Ryan was “very friendly”, but I told him I did not Know who I was talking too and anything about their company, so why should I trust you?” His response was that I had been talking to him (maybe one minute?  and I told him I didn’t trust companies contacting me the way that they had and the phone went dead.

  24. I am totally new in here, i had no idea about what you guys have been debating. But instead of enjoying the actual post, i enjoyed reading your conversations instead HAHAH. Although i think its gonna take me half a day to read all of them. Peace to you all, just don’t be too harsh with each other. Regards from The finance frog.

    • Please don’t throw away your letters or pink slips.  They will be proof of the scam or unlawful misrepresentation when a class action lawsuit is awarded. 

  25. I have no debt that they speak of…have no idea how they got my name, but my mail from them is sent to my company and so there is a big question………..the guy would not let me talk so I hung up.

  26. I went with Credit Arbitrators for 1 year and it absolutely ruined my credit and riped me off. They only settled one debt and left me with 6 and 3 court appearances. Please be on the look out for these predators as they will not deliver as promised. I plan to take my complaints to BBB to see if there is anything that can be done about this. I am sure I am not the only one to be taken advantage of. Please do not let them scam you. If I could find a firm that is pursuing legal action on them I would join the team. If anyone knows anyone else I can contact please let me know. Boy have I paid dearly.

  27. Received several notices from this company to pay off my credit card debt and activate my debt mediation plan which they said they sent to me in July. I don’t recall ever requesting a package from them. After reading all the posts here, I am not going to respond to the “final notice that will expire”. Thanks for all your input.

  28. These people are using  advertising with letters that look like collection notices. I tried filing a complaint through the Beter Business Bureau–guess what? They already scored an “F”. Guess we’re not the first to complain. Contact the FTC and file a complaint: FTC Bureau of Consumer Protection (www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov) and also the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau : http://www.consumerfinance.gov. Take them out!!!

    • This is the BBB’s report link:  http://www.bbb.org/dallas/business-reviews/debt-relief-services/credit-resolution-advisors-in-plano-tx-90385330

  29. Why would somebody buy out investors when a competent operator could start the company again from scratch?  Usually it is because the company is worth more being sold as a going concern than it would yield by selling the desks, phones, computers and chairs for whatever used office furniture goes for.  A lot of that value is an intangible something called “good will.”  The company has a reputation, contacts and a presence in the marketplace that have value.  So my question is, why buy out a boiler room operation and change the name (effectively throwing away the goodwill)?  Perhaps the “goodwill” had no value but he got the office equipment cheap?

  30. OMG !!!!!! I almost did this, thank god I saw this. I had no idea they just stopped paying the credit card companies. Wow, this guy is supposed to call me back at 12 today. Now what do i do he has all my info ?????

    • Just tell him that you have changed your mind and you do not wish to sign up right now. You have plenty of time to research additional options. It sounds like they have not even explained the basics of debt settlement, that alone is reason enough to stay away from this program.

      If you tell me a little more about your situation, I may be able to provide some assistance.

  31. This horrible economy took its toll on a lot of people just trying to keep their heads above water.  I am in the same boat.  I recently signed up for the Dave Ramsey program that puts everything in perspective.  It has taught me how to organize my finances and start chipping away at my debt step by step.

    Highly recommend the Dave Ramsey program — not CR Advisors.  You owe it to yourself to at least check it out  daveramsey.com

    Best wishes.

    • Haven’t been here in months but I see my legacy lives on!  Awesome!  Some ‘Washington DC Lawmaker’ is bashing me because I’m not versed in Federal Trade Commission laws and operational procedures.  Seems silly..

      For about the 10th time, I don’t work for, or have any financial ties to this company. I work in the Healthcare industry, corporate wellness to be more precise.  The only tie I have to the company is that someone I know signed up, went through the program, paid half what she owed, and can now enjoy her retirement.  Did her credit get hurt?  Yes, but a) it was already getting hit because of missed and late payments, and b) she has no need for credit.  She owns a house, a car, she’s on social security, and a retirement plan.  Why is it important for her to have a shiny credit score when no one will lend her any money anyway, because of the 50k she owed?  I know this, it definitely made no sense for her to keep paying interest and minimum payments just to keep that shiny worthless credit score.  And besides, her credit card now is under control and her credit is on the rise again. 

       I liked the guys response above about the chainsaw enema.  That was hilarious! Poor guy came here looking for some proof and help, and all he got was Damon and I going back and forth.  Again, (11th time), I don’t work for the company and can’t give you contracts or legalities or proof.  I am a consumer just like you and only responded…ONLY RESPONDED…because the first entry I read was ‘definitely a scam’.  And I thought..’well that’s not true’.  And I shared my experience.  In doing so I have pissed off others in the industry (Damon), some FTC lawmaker with 40 years in the banking business who will supposedly take me on any day, and has apparently also invited me for an all expenses paid trip to washington to meet his financial committee buddies, and a bunch of igorant (the deragotary kind) people. 
      Just for the record I have never been to DC and that sounds like a fantastic trip, I would love to take you up on that mr lawmaker! 

      All of your favorite companies have thousands of complaints against them.  The company that manufactures the device that you use to view this website does.  The company that provides internet access so you’re able to view this website does.  The companies that some of these posters work for also have thousands of complaints filed against them.  So what?  That doesn’t mean anything except a fraction ( .00x%) or smaller of America had a negative response.  I can tell a bully that he’s an a-hole and guess what, he will probably have a negative response.

      Many of you dont even seem to understand what unsecured debt is, which is made clear by you telling us your car and mortgage payments are up to date.  I agree with Damon when he says the company’s main priority isnt to educate.  The companies main priority is to settle debt for clients in a profitable fashion…whats that called again? capitalism, thats right.  It can be, and actually is argued that our country’s EDUCATIONAL SYSTEM isn’t even focused on education.  How on earth would you expect a for profit business to have your individual understanding its utmost priority?  That is seriously stupid.  Not stupid to wish for it, not stupid to hope for it, but very stupid to believe that a company cares less about their money than your peace of mind.

      To those of you who are so hilariously sure, undeniably and unequivocally absolutely, positively SURE, that this is a scam…please, tell me.  Why did they spare my Auntie?  She would have been an easy target.  Nobody here, not Damon, not the lawmaker, and not a single one of you ignorant fools can provide me with an answer to that. 

      And the reason is because it isn’t a scam.  At least not by the literal and modern definition of scam.  It seems many of you have a very loose translation of the word scam….by many of your own definitions wal mart is a scam.  Time warner cable is a scam, Chevrolet is a scam, Oreo’s are a scam because they charge 3.49 for a pack that takes 50 cents to make AND one time I got a stale cookie!  Some of you people are so hilariously rediculous that I just cant wait to log back on in 6 months and see what I have stirred up.

      and honestly, nobody can go toe to toe with me because nobody has the capacity to tell me that I didn’t really experience the things I experienced.  I only got long winded because I like defending myself against people who think they can make me appear stupid just because they think they are smarter than me.  Deep down I love this stuff…blow for blow with the masses watching.  Not just brute strength of argument but morality and integrity of characters, as well as fact are on display not for a single judge, but for a collection of individuals. 

      Some of you think I’m wrong, some think I’m right, some think I’m stupid, some might think i’m smart, and some are too stupid to even form a cohesive opinion of me and respond only with ‘horseshit’.  Lol that made me laugh.  See you all in February, if the world doesn’t end on the winter solstice.

      • Not sure why this is so hard for you to grasp. I never said they can’t settle anyones debt. Anyone that can open a mail box can settle debt. The “scam” part comes in when they have sales people pitching a program as a cure all and charging a hefty fee to people who should never be in the program in the first place. You made my point for me. They are in business to make money, not to help people. Some people like your Aunt get lucky in spite of the horrible program. The point is, many companies like this hurt a lot more people than they help, but they take money from all of them. 

        Here you have a situation where you have a sales person pretending to understand how to resolve a persons financial situation, and passing off their BS program as a great solution when it certainly is not. 

        When you sell a program under false pretenses and a majority of the people that give you money don’t experience the result that was so confidently sold to them, what would you call it?

        • your an idiot, you really believe what your saying? you know absolutely nothing about anything your talking about…like they say the highest form of ignorance is rejecting something you know nothing about.

          • that was for damon btw. idiot the real scam is the bank you moron and they’re laughing at all of you. lets see who is A. full disclosure, tells you its hurting your credit temporarily upfront and doing what they said they will, and B. non of the above have fine print on all of their credit card agreements make 50 fold what A. does per account, greedy abusive and constantly change their terms on consumers and are not upfront…in case your a complete moron which i can tell a lot of you don’t even have the sort of intellect you could find in a jack-ass. is Credit resolution advisors, and B. are the banks that are robbing you blind and your too dumb to realize it.

          • So what you are saying is that if a consumer is ripped off for 10,000 by the bank and then you only rip them off for 5,000 more, what you have done is justified because what the bank did was worse?

            That is your argument, and you are calling me a Moron?

            That’s brilliant.

  32. I hesitate to respond to unsolicited mailings from this LLC.  They began with a letter stating I had outstanding credit balances (I do not) and to contact them immediately to remedy my precarious situation. We have politicians and journalists who peddle fear to promote agendas marketed under false pretenses.  CRA sent me my :Final Notice” yesterday.

    In very fine print at the bottom their last letter it states “…CreditResolution Advisors, LLC is not a lender, creditor or collector…Information being used is public information and any person can opt out by calling the number listed on the catalog  or by going to http://www.mail-opt-out.org“.  I never “opted in!”

    Is my credit information “public information?” I don’t fully believe that is correct.

    What is the Warning Level for CRA?  Red, do not enter.

  33. what a scam i work for a credit card company and this company willm rip you off,,dont believe a word they say and dont give them your cc number the last 3 numbers and ex date..never give that info they charged all kinds of fees to a clients cc without permission..thye are under investigation

  34. I recieved two notices from them “advertising” their services but I have no debt. I do spend a lot on my credit cards and have had some revolving debt from time to time, but I generally pay my cards off. I asked how did they know on average how much I spend on my credit cards and she said it is “public information” and that it is supplied to them “your county”. First of all that is crazy – my county doe snot have access to my financial statements. The whole things seems suspect to me and very shady.


  36. I called to tell CRA to stop sending me notices every week and they insulted me and said good luck with your debt you will never pay it off! I feel like contacting the Better Business Bureau!

  37. Steve, used to work for this company. i left after 2 years because i could no longer wash the stink off. Changed name 3 times while i was there. don’t forget about their sister company, The Jensen Legal Group or Credit Relief Advocates. Same company, same sales people, same scam. they teach you to tippy toe around the rules and regulations and to say anything to get the client to sign. terrible place, drinking on the job, former criminals work there. just terrible. so to recap…Credit Answers, Credit Arbitrators, Credit Resolution Advisors, Jensen Legal Group, Credit Relief Advocates, same company, same scam artists. 5 names in 2 1/2 years same crooks.

  38. O my!  Then odds are the mailer I got this morning is no doubt the same company, only mine is titled CRV, 5700 Granite Parkway, Plano TX.  Snapping my finger, darn it, it sounded like such a good deal.  Thank goodness for the internet. 

  39. Based on their first call they do not know who my accounts are with or what my balances are, and I sure as hell won’t be providing that information to total strangers over the phone.  I politely said “No thank you.”  Then I got a letter.  My account “activation” has been “approved.” Based on what?  Then I got a pink letter, 2nd notice … this is an intimidation tactic.  I don’t intimidate.  If these rectal orifices had a legitimate product they would not have to hound me and send pink late notices to get me to bite on their deal.  Only the government does that.  Their follow up calls are now tagged as “spam” so I never have to answer them.  BTW, I am only running a balance on 2 accounts with minimal interest rates and nowhere near their limits.  The house is paid for, utilities paid in advance for a year, car almost paid off, etc.  No lates, even a day for over 10 years.  But these facts do not matter because CRA does not care, they just want to make their commissions, probably do some fancy accounting with the escrow accounts, and probably leave me with a “settled for less than agreed” derogatory on my credit reports. 

  40. They are so willing and eager to reduce my credit card debt.  They are demanding I contact them and are certain they can do so much to help.  Not sure how they plan to help.  I have one (1) credit card and do not owe anything on it.

  41. Just got off the phone with a real nice lady at this company…  spoke with her for at least 30 minutes…  I’m 20 grand + in credit card debt (I know, my own fault) and the interest is killing me…  I’m paying over $500 per month total just making minimum monthly payments…  This company said my payment with them would be $349 for 36 months and that was a ‘high estimate’…  they usually negotiate lower, so I might only need to pay 30 months instead of 36…  I asked if this would hurt my credit, and she politely responded that most people want to get out of credit card debt and want to be free of credit cards, so yes, it will hurt, but I can always bring it back up…  If this company is so evil, Please suggest one that is less evil because $349 per month for 3 years and I’m COMPLETELY OUT OF DEBT is a lot better than 18 and 25% interest and paying for the next 10+ years…  Oh and she did say they do charge 12% interest for their fees and everything is included in that $349 per month…
    So, again, Who is a Good company to go with because I’m tired of paying high interest and I’d like to get out of debt! 

    • The clear problem with them and many debt settlement companies is that you got off the sales pitch thinking that they offer an easy monthly payment plan for only 349 a month. 

      You shouldn’t be thinking how low will my payments be. You should be thinking how fast can you raise the money that you will need to settle these accounts so that you can try to avoid getting sued. The sales person is trained to sell you their program, not to analyze your situation and provide the best solution.

      • thanks for the reply, Damon…  I’m not too familiar with this process, so I’m not following you when you say ‘how fast can you raise the money that you will need to settle these accounts so that you can try to avoid getting sued’…  who is gonna get sued??!  Me??!  I don’t want to get sued!  not that I own anything anyway, except for my truck, but I’m still making payments on it…  I haven’t signed up for anything yet, that’s why I’m in this forum…  I’m asking questions… 

        • Sure, happy to help. Let me clarify the way debt settlement works.

          1. You stop paying your creditors for a period of time.
          2. After you fall far enough behind, your creditors will likely agree to settle your debt for a reduced amount.

          That is essentially how it works. Whether you hire someone to do this or you do it yourself, it works the same way.

          So the issue I have is when sales people frame the argument around monthly payments without explaining the reality of what is going on. There is no such thing as a monthly payment in debt settlement, the creditors are not getting any of the money until you have enough to settle the debt, or a term settlement is reached.

          So the settlement company can tell you any number they want. 325 a month, 300 a month, whatever. The bottom line is that your creditor is not getting any of that money for a long period of time and at some point, they may just decide to file a lawsuit since they haven’t been paid.

          So the goal should not be low monthly payments. Your goal should be to save as much money as fast as you can so that you can get a negotiated settlement done with your creditors as fast as possible and not drag it out for 3 years to have “lower payments” If there is a way to raise the money faster, that should be explored.

          Now every consumer’s situation is different and unfortunately most debt relief sales people only know how to punch numbers into a computer and tell you what gets spit out. They do not take the time or in many cases, even have the ability to actually figure out a realistic strategy if it differs from the cookie cutter settlement approach that they offer to every consumer.

          Bottom line, if a settlement strategy does make sense for you, you must figure out how to get in and out as quickly as possible. Dragging it out 3 years is not a very ideal strategy.

          • Oh wow…  it’s starting to make sense and ‘click’ now!  Well, I haven’t fallen behind on any of my credit card payments…  I’ve just been making the minimum payments because that is all I can afford right now…  I do, however, recall the lady from Credit Resolution Advisors saying that my monthly payments to them are put in an escrow account or something similar that accrews money…  So, in the meantime, while I’m making payments to this company, will I be receiving collection letters from my 5 credit cards??!  My understanding is that they were going to contact my credit card companies and handle everything for me…  and I can make higher payments to this company (more than the $349 per month) to pay them off quicker… 
            I briefly just explained this to my cousin who has some credit issues and she was wondering HOW LONG this ruins or ‘hurts’ your credit…  3 years?  6 years? etc…  Any how, I’m really just wanting this debt to go away…  I’m tired of it and would like to move on with my life…  I’m only 29 and I’d like to start saving more money and only spending the money if I have it rather than charging…  It was after college that I was unemployed and started charging…  that was 2005 and now it’s just getting bigger and bigger every year, so I figure if I don’t have a credit card, I won’t be able to charge on it!  I only make about $800 per month right now…  I don’t pay rent, work for family, and get paid in cash…  about $300 goes toward my truck payment, and most of the left over money each month goes towards credit card debt…  I don’t know…  I haven’t made up my mind yet, but it’s been very difficult to save any money lately…  Does me mentioning this Escrow comment change anything from your previous comment??!  just curious…  Again, thanks for the help and advice! 

          • I’d suggest you first read How to Get Out of Debt. The Honest and Unvarnished Truth and The Truth About The Success Rates, Failure Rates and Completion Rates of Credit Counseling, Debt Settlement, and Bankruptcy. They will give you a great overview of what we need to deal with to get you moving in the right direction.

            Then use the free How to Get Out of Debt Calculator to review your options.

            After that, come back here and comment about what seems to make the most sense and let’s discuss that.

          • I just contacted the CRA today to help my elderly mother consolidate her credit card debt.  They will call me back tomorrow and I want to be prepared.  All of this talk has scared me away from this company but I still have the issue with my mother:  She is 81 years old, only able to pay the minimum on her 4 credit cards (total $16,000 debt) and is on a fixed low income.  She is currently living in our condo and just sold her car (can’t drive anymore).  She has no assets.  Where can I turn to help her honestly consolidate her debt?  Should she declare bankruptcy?

          •  I would absolutely recommend you and your mother speak with a Bankruptcy attorney before making a final decision on what to do.

            I don’t know if bankruptcy is the best option without knowing more about your situation, but I know for sure that the sales rep from CRA will be pitching you hard on a monthly payment program and telling you to stay away from bankruptcy.

            What is the source of your mothers income?

            Whatever you do, don’t let them pressure you into signing up tomorrow. You have plenty of time to get real answers before you make an important decision like this.

            If settlement does turn out to be a viable option then you should compare CRA to other programs and even consider negotiating directly with the creditors without hiring a company.

            On the surface though, given your mothers situation, bankruptcy is likely going to be the best option.

            Fill out this form on here and we can assist you in finding a local bankruptcy attorney to contact to review your mothers situation.


      • That’s the DEAL….you have to save enough $$$ to pay back what they will negotiate which can be as long as 1-2 years and as a Rep told me I would get letters and harassing phone calls asking where the CC companies $$$ is.

        •  That may be the deal they are pitching you, but in my experience the plan is almost never implemented in the best interests of you the consumer. It is usually more geared toward getting them paid the quickest, not getting you out of debt the quickest.

          Further, please don’t rely on a sales person to tell you that what they sell is the best strategy for you.

          Ever go to a Toyota dealer and have the sales person tell you that a Honda was a much better buy?

  42. Just signed up with Credit Resolution Advisors.  I have about 45k in cc debt and they set me up on a program to get debt free in 3 years.  My money is in an account that only I can authorize payment from and everything seems legit so far. Seems like a lot of negetive feedback comes from junk mail that they send, but so far, it has been a pretty good relationship

    • I also just signed up and now scared they will take my money and not help with my debt.  I think I will call them on the next business day to get more info.

    • So, glad to hear someone posting about actual experience with the company. I just signed up too. It is a bit scary and risky to trust them or anyone in this area. But if they do what they claim it will be such a relief. 

      •  well I asked a question about keeping one card for emergencies and dispersing the debt for that one card among my other cards…  The lady I spoke with, Sherri Blackburn (real nice and honest by the way), said that they CANNOT negotiate down Transferred Balances, which happens to be Most of my debt…  So I think my only other option at this point is Bankruptcy…  I’m hearing from other people that it’s not what it used to be…  Doesn’t ruin your credit for 7 years (a lot shorter time period these days)…  So, I’m going to speak with an attorney this week…  Being unemployed, my minimum payments have eaten up my savings and this sucks!  I just wanna be done with it!  Any advice on what to ask the bankruptcy attorney is appreciated…  Thanks

      • Too many typical ppl out there quick to trash this as a scam.  However, it is 1 of the only ways to lower your unsecure debt and pay it off completely in 3-5 years.  Why do ppl claim it as a scam if they really have NOOOO IDEA!!!  Romney parasites!!!

        • And 1 more thing…once you get passed the BS marketing tricks like the junkmail and 100 DBA names, it is actually a quality service.  The gentleman I spoke to in Plano, TX was proffessional, intelligent, and informative (which was a suprise since its TX).  And no pressure at all! I love all these idiots that are complaining to authorities and BBB and there congressman…LOL.  Your wasting your not so precious time.  What do you think your gonna accomplish.  Also,  love the ppl who say “but I have no debt” and “how did they get this info” and “its wrong”.  News for these ppl…You have some sort of unsecured debt or they wouldnt waste the paper on you. 

    • Nice to hear something positive!  Its a shame that these websites feed the perpetual
      “angry” who fill their time complaining about a “letter” or some other trivial inconvenience where they feel they have been wronged.  People come to these forums looking for factual experiences not your whining.  If you have had a personal experience whether it be something like your trip to Disney Land or your debt settlement program, then post it….good or bad.  But quit complaining about a piece of mail you received for debt settlement or God forbid, a solicitation to visit Disney Land that you never asked for.  I am sure that made you mad and you felt the need to contact the authorities about that too!

      BTW- for those of you who are now offended that I used the DL example, this was just for comparison purposes, not because someone actually mentioned DL in one of these posts!

      • Let me pose a hypothetical. If the company really is doing a bad thing and taking advantage of consumers, why would you want to hear something positive? Isn’t it possible that hundreds of consumers complaining are actually correct?

  43. Steve, I just had an email exchange with Rick Brown, the executive vice president of Credit Resolution.  I had received their misleading, dishonest, manipulative mailer twice.   It’s an anonymous envelope, 3 fold and tear tabs, with an official warning on the outside that you see only on government mail.  I filed two complaints with the Texas Attorney General’s Consumer Protection Division.  I also told Brown that I would continue to file complaints if they continued sending me their crap.  Anyone with a complaint against the company should file a complaint with the Consumer Protection Division.  The CPD’s site and form for complaints is easy to access through the Attorney General’s Office

  44. Am filing complaint with Better Business Bureau about this company.  The information they said that had about me was completely false!!!!!!!!!  They would not tell me who I owed the so called money to nor would they tell me how they got the information.   When I asked the woman I was speaking to what her name was she hung up on me.

  45. I’m one of those pissed off people who asked CreditResolutionAdvisors to remove my name. He wouldn/t do it and kept telling me how much they could save me. I would never recommend them to anyone. They do need to be brought down. It’s incredable that unscrupulous companies can exist.

    ‘Postmasters may not refuse to accept PS Form 1500 because the advertisement in question does not appear to be
    erotically arousing or sexually provocative. Only the addressee may make that determination”:

    USPS Form 1500 enables you to notify sexually-explicit mailers to cease
    mailing you. Many consumers have used this form to notify other
    marketers when they repeatedly ignore their requests to be removed from
    their mailing lists. This form is available at the Post Office or online
    at: http://about.usps.com/forms/ps1500.pdf

  47.  U.S. Postal Service. If you have questions or complaints about mail fraud, theft, tampering, or obscene or pornographic mail, contact the Postal Inspector. To find the nearest office, call the U.S. Postal Service at (800) 275-8777, (800 ASK-USPS), or online at http://www.usps.gov.
    Form 1500 enables you to notify sexually-explicit mailers to cease
    mailing you. Many consumers have used this form to notify other
    marketers when they repeatedly ignore their requests to be removed from
    their mailing lists. This form is available at the Post Office or online
    at: http://about.usps.com/forms/ps1500.pdf

    ‘Sexually explicit’ is always subjective, if you get my drift…

  48. PSS… Maybe instead of informing us on the laws of CRA operations, you inform Bill on the laws the federal governments overtime pay for workers who work over 40 hours. Bill might need help there too! Mr. Loughborough seems to prefer his own method of law instead of the ones the Federal Government set. That is public record court docs. Plano federal court house if you are so inclined to look. Anytime you feel the need to speak come and speak to law makers so we can better the law and stop the scam. But you will not come and you will use a clever counter remark to justify yourself. I will even pay for your ticket, hotel, food, and entertainment. Just know you will be sworn in under oath and anything you say can, and WILL be used against you in court of law. I will not be holding my breathe. As you will not come.

  49. Ahart04. I will take you on any day of the week. If your beloved CRA is above the board then why is legislation right now being worked on to make you oops CRA a cease operation when caught in active practice of credit renegotiations? I am a 40 plus year banking industry expert with inside connection to the FTC and financial sub comities. You arguments come from a lack of knowledge in the laws of the FTC. One, after the mortgage industry debacle, congress has set it’s scope one your industry. Over 3,467 complaints just on CRA in the last 18 months not to mention your owners numerous other company complaints which are public record not the like the credit card info you claim you get is public record. No… And I stress no, debt incurred by an individual through acts of spending, loan repayment, or secured or unsecured debt which are credit cards will never be made public knowledge. PERIOD. If you commit a crime, owe the local, state or federal branches of government, those debt ARE public record! This just show how they (CRA) teach their work force to defend the business. I will beg you to come and sit with me in Washington DC and defend your industries practices in front of the finance committee that is preparing a lengthy and I believe with teeth law for you and the likes of your peers. We know the racket, we hear the masses and action is being created for solutions to end the industry as you perceive it. Just to show how incompetent you sound on this board, I do not feel more comfortable dealing with a company like yours when it comes to their financial wealth. The more money you have the more I give you and how does that make it better for me? It is shameful how young and unwise you sound. There is nothing you can do that the debtor can not do themselves for FREE! FYI Banks pay for their information to send out credit offers, the bureaus just don’t hand it to them. There is only two ways to get out of debt, spend less or make more. Economics 101. Bankrupt is better than CRA-rupt.

    • your an absolute moron. r2112lee what does that stand for retard 2112, anyways im not going to go through all of the bullshit you said because there was a lot of it for sure…but just to point out, your debt and my debt and every1’s debt is in fact public information and that is because the banks sell and share it with off shore parties as well as scammers as you would say all around the world. Idiot i cant believe you live in fairy tale la la land where you actually believe your beloved banks dont commit crimes everyday and cover it all up. and by the way you are lying out of your ass claiming that type of stature and then stating absolute nonsense, your 40 plus years with banks and your so called connections are a joke to anyone who knows anything.

        • Slow down for a moment. Deep breath. I’ve never heard from any person their personal information was stolen, just that they were pitched something for money.

          At this point, if you are not interested I’d call them and tell them so. Next, you may want to find a credit report monitoring service and just keep an eye on your credit report for any unusual activity. CreditKarma.com now offers a free service to do this.

          • Help! I fell for the scam last night and gave them my info as well. Tried to call back but number is no good. What can I do to prevent them from using any of the info I’ve given them? I feel like an idiot

  50. When CRA representatives call just tell them your State Attorney General’s Office is interested in the improper actions perpetrated by CRA and its subsidiaries and you will call your AGO’s office. Ask for their name and see how they handle it. Good Luck!

  51. I keep getting these scam letters.  I am not having debt problems, and feel that I’m being targeted because I’m retired, and they probably think they can panic me into doing something styupid.

  52. Wow, this entire comment thread is about as useful as a chainsaw enema, and half as funny. I came on google looking for some answers since I received 2 letter in relatively short order. I do have close to 25K in personal debt. I wanted some more info about the company. About the only useful information is that they mail people a lot, and they have changed name and format a few times. Otherwise there has been little to nothing in the way of proof, or really useful information from either side of the argument. I guess I was naive to think a web board could ever, and I do mean EVER provide anything remotely useful. Instead I get to read the equivalent of a bunch of men standing around talking about how much bigger their dicks are.

    Thanks for nothing, except for a laugh or two.

    •  SpiffyOne, I am in a near exact same situation as you.  I have received these mailings from Credit Resolutions Advisers.  I do have a ton of credit card debt.  I want to get out of debt, but I just don’t know who to believe.  I talked to an associate with this company on the phone for 2 hours.  She SEEMED like a genuine honest person who is not out to scam me.  But I REALLY don’t know for sure.  I have found no answers from this forum.  I am extremely frustrated and extremely stressed.

        •  Sorry for the really late response.  I did not end up going with CRA.  I am possibly headed toward bankruptcy but I am hopeful that when my big credit card finally maxes out, I will then be allowed to go on a payment program to pay it off slowly but surely, like I am doing with a different card.

      • WE usede this company and 4 yrs later we still owe 35000.00 the use our money for their fees and so on we were taken for about 18000.00 and they paid aprox 4000.00 of our debt to credit card. we were paying 900.00 a month and were to be debt free in 2 to 3 years. still fighting to get a refund but will not happen.

    • Hi. I feel the same way as you about this thread as well.  I received a letter from them and wanted to get some information before I did anything. Some web boards have proved to be useful to me, but all this has given me is a laugh and wasted about 10 minutes of my time…..

      • I guess when a group of people tell you a company is harassing them for nothing, it’s funny? That wouldn’t be a clue to you that maybe the company is not on the up and up–that they are trying to scam people who in fact have no debt issues into some sort of response? When they send letters that look like threats to hundreds of people who have negligible debt that isn’t a hint?

        Forgive me, but it helps me to understand why you might be in the situation you are in.

    • Spiff – same for me! I talked with a rep at CRA, and like the other poster, they seemed genuine. I am doing research and although CRA offered a pretty sizable reduction in debt (40%), I think I can do better and will keep looking. I see nothing here to indicate they are scammers – i.e., that they don’t do what they say they will, so please stop, people, with all the whines about junk mail. We all get it, but folks here are trying to find out if anyone has actually done business with CRA and what that experience was like. I don’t need to hear about your junk mail! Got enough of my own thanks.

  53. The owners of CRA or CreditResolution Advisors should be arrested for fraud and deceit.

    I’m contacting the FBI.

    The more people who contact the FBI, the quicker these guys will be on the lam.

  54. Must be a scam. I received pink notices from them trying to renegotiate A credit card balance that does not exist.

  55. I should have checked this place first.  I just made a complaint to the Federal Trade Commission and the Better Business Bureau, probably won’t do a whole lot, but I’m tired of their deceptive mailings making my heart drop every time I see “Final Notice” in the mail.  Considering the only major debt I have is my truck and my house, I just want this crap to stop.

  56. So glad I found this thread.Other postings confirming my suspicions. 
    A letter from CRA addressed to my mother looked like a collection notice and knowing full well she doesn’t have collection agency worthy debt, I opened it to see what it was.  The way the letter was formatted disturbed me. I called my mom ( she’s presently out of country, traveling through retirement) told her I knew it wasn’t a collection letter but was concerned nonetheless. She asked me to please try to get them to stop bothering her. It seems they somehow obtained her cell #and have begun calling her excessively. 
    After a few minutes,she then told me something very disturbing: when she logged into her bank account, she found it to be grossly overdrawn. Multiple purchases made mostly via telephone and a few online with her debit card. She gave me one of the phone #’s listed on transaction so I could  look into that business, maybe find out something about the purchases- keep in mind she is out of the country- When I checked the 800 #, surprise surprise, it was issued to the Plano,TX address CRA utilizes! Interesting… 
    If I may address  Ahart04- You may want to re-evaluate your own ignorant proclamation regarding the sharing of personal financial information. Your quote- “The information that leads you to reserve a letter is shared by banks, and credit bureaus. This information is public…”  You are so wrong. Under the Fair Credit Reporting Act, “a credit bureau can only provide this information to people and businesses with a legitimate right to obtain it” And…. 3rd party sharing is limited to the assistance in conducting normal business,or marketing institution’s OWN  products and services FCRA allows for affiliate sharing (other parts of the  SAME corporate family) So,unless CRA belongs to one of the credit reporting agencies, CRA cannot be getting info there… Oh, and as for banks??  They DON’T share for joint marketing with other financial institutions.


    • I’m sorry but you’re wrong. The banks and credit bureaus do share this information. It is shared the exact same way as when you have patterns if good credit. Why isn’t anyone on here upset that discover sent them a cc offer with their name and address on it? Regardless of how upset it makes you that companies can obtain this information. It is not illegal. You even proved that in your quote directly under mine. Read it more carefully. Banks an bureaus share this information because it is in their best interest to do so. I never said that “banks share for joint marketing with other institutions”, I simply said the information comes from them. Are you sure your mom didn’t enroll in the program? And are you sure of this because that’s what she told you? My friend is elderly and didn’t understand alot of what was happening exactly with the program, however, they repeatedly told her to call the cx service dept if she had any questions at all. She probably called that number 100 times and said that that was what truly made it a good experience. Maybe you should call that number and see what your mom signed up for. If it’s a mistake, they will unenroll you, there’s no contract or termination fee. What I said was not an ignorant proclamation, it’s just hard for people to hear. No one wants their info public when it’s bad info, only good. Sadly, it goes both ways.

      • Ahart, you seem to spend a lot of time trying to defend the actions of this company for someone that doesn’t have any financial ties to them. So if I understand you, you are saying that the sales person signed up your elderly friend even though she “didn’t understand alot of what was happening exactly with the program?” And now it seems that Lawprincess’s  mother has experienced the same sales pitch (big on promises, short on actual details)

        Um…. sort of proves my point that these guys are just out there going for the sale and not really educating the consumer doesn’t it?

        Explain how convincing someone to sign up into a program that they don’t fully understand is a good thing? 

        • Because she saved almost 20 thousand dollars and was debt free in 2 years instead of 30. That’s why. I love the lady but you can explain to her something clear as day and just like some people, she will still need to be told again and again.

    • You all who think this is a scam, are wrong. Obviously you are misinformed, but it is ok to understand why.

      In 2005 when the debt settlement industry exploded, there were no federal regulations moderating these companies. The industry sustained terrible feedback from unethical companies and is still somewhat tarnished. After the government stepped in with new regulations, in October of 2010, the company changed it’s name for the second time to credit resolution advisors. It’s first name change was simply due to the fact that the CEO bought out his investors.
      Back to 2010: federal regulations allowed debt settlement firms to continue operating as normal IF they qualified for one of three exemptions. The exemption that credit resolution advisors operates under is the catalogue/direct mail exemption. This is was FEDERAL REGULATION. If it was up to CRA, they would have rather stayed with their previous form of marketing, which was mostly radio advertisements.

      The company works wonders.

      And is one of the few premier debt settlement firms that have made it through the industry changes with integrity in tact.

      ALL of the complaints here seem to be based on the direct mail marketing strategy. No one has even commented on the service, which saves Americans THOUSANDS of dollars off of unsecured debt balances. They renegotiate balances of debt to lower your principal, and help you to set up a special account to which you would put money in, in order to pay for these renegotiated settlements. They can save you often times more than HALF of your prinicpal. They do this because of bulk settlement processes. For example: 1000 accounts with 1 million dollars in debt will be brought to an institution and offered say, 600 thousand as a settlement. The company will take 600 grand as they would rather have some money than none at all.

      This company(s) has repaired over 200 million dollars for indebted Americans over the past 6 years.

      For those of you who say you have no debt, or are receiving the letter unduly, consider this:

      The information that leads you to reserve a letter is shared by banks, and credit bureaus. This information is public, shared the SAME way as when you receive a credit card offer for good credit. Only the letter is sent because of delinquencies, raised interest rates, or patterns of minimum payments and or financial hardships.

      If you receive the letter and you have no debts, no medical bills, and you have not cosigned for any credit, then please check your credit report and make sure you are not a victim of identity theft or fraud. Many people do not know their spouse has racked up 50k in credit card bills and resort to bad mouthing the company for it’s letters.

      Direct marketing is perhaps not the most attractive way reach
      people, however, again, CRA was pushed in this direction by the federal government.

      This is not a scam. Those of you who are so quick to believe such are just ignorant. It’s ok, I understand, but hopefully my post can serve as a beacon of light to someone struggling with debt. This company aims to help people, and does so in amazing fashion. I’m not saying that there aren’t scams out there, but credit resolution advisors are simply not one of them.

      And if you think I can make all of that up, then you are not just ignorant, but in denial as well. Just as many Americans are about the severity of their financial situation. Take care and remember…this is not a scam, but a legitimate, ethical, profitable, company that has helped and continues to help thousands of American eliminate their debt and begin to move forward.

      • Serioiusly Ahart?
        This is your best approach? I would think that the sales manager would have advised you not to call consumers who are unhappy with your service as nothing but ignorant and uninformed people.

        The way your program is marketed is shameful in my opinion, and for all those people you supposedly help, you didn’t mention all the millions you made from the people that never received the promised help. 

        So please don’t come in here and offer some half truths and call anyone who doesn’t believe you ignorant.

        • Ignorance isn’t a put down. By definition, it simply means that you don’t have all of the information. And I haven’t addressed anyone who has used the service, only those of you have been marketed to. It’s your right to have the opinion that the marketing is shameful, but again, government regulations gave few choices.

          As far as the profits, that is only a good thing. Would you rather hire a broke company? Or a profitable one. I know my answer. And who are these people that never received the promised help? The company doesn’t promise anything past the guarantee they have in place, and most of the clients that don’t succeed in the program fail because they spend more than they make. No one can get out of debt like that no matter who is ‘promising’ what.

          Also, please specify what you believe to be a ‘half truth’ and I will provide reference to show you it is in fact full truth. To say I’m giving half truths is just wrong. I’m not a spokesperson of the company, it’s not my job to do damage control on negative press. Bi just noticed that I was by far the most informed poster and decided to give my 2 cents. Most above me including you have no true facts. Most are basing they’re responses on emotional feelings. Again, I understand. It’s no biggy.

          • Hello Ahart,
            I understand. Perhaps things have recently changed along with their name (which in in of itself raises a red flag).

            I know the definition of ignorance, but that is not the context in which you used it. Perhaps next time you should use the word uninformed. Taken into context, any reader would assume your phrase was derogatory.

            You mention a guarantee, can you tell me what the specifics are on that?

            Half Truth = Not telling the truth.

            Please see

            Credit Answers Runs Misleading Ad

            Please post a copy of your contract for my review so that I can have “the true facts”

            Your website says that Credit Resolution Advisors provides Debt Mediation. Can you please explain how this is different than Debt Settlement?

            I look forward to your response.

          • ok, ill try to cover everything in order.

            you think the name change raises a red flag.  does it also raise a red flag for these companies who have also changed their names?:

            healthy choice
            mcafee inc.
            or Gmac to ally financial….???

            no? are all these companies bad because they have gone through name changes?  i’m just pointing out that you should be consistent with your arguments.

            ok, next.  maybe youre right about using the word ignorant.  those who are unsure of the literal definition could take it as derogatory. (sorry everyone!  not the intention)

            like i implied earlier, which i dont think you understood, i am not an employee of the company, so to answer your question, i cannot give you the exact guarantee.  i BELIEVE it is something to this effect:

            you will never pay more than what you owe to the creditor.  for example, if you owe 10k, and for some reason they arent able to settle for enough (extremely unlikely), then you will never, with CRA’s fees included, pay one red cent more than 10000.  the fees from CRA will be waived.

            there is also a money back guarantee but the time length and guidelines for this i am completely unsure of.

            i’m glad you defined half truth, but i asked if you could specify which of my statements you thought to be half truths, or now by your definition, are not true.  i did not post any.  im not on here to lie, but tell my experience and the facts that i know from that experience.  i hope youre not just resorting to calling me a liar. no need to character assassinate.

            next, you believe CRAs direct mailing campaign is ‘misleading’…I AGREE.

            i have seen the letter and if you dont read it carefully, you may think its from a debt collector or creditor, also, there is some uncertainty surrounding the ‘deadline’.  also, at a first glance, it does look like a bill.

            the purpose of the company however is not to mislead you.  the marketing department of CRA has one job: to get the phones to ring.

            lets take a hypothetical scenario for example:

            a lady calls in, because the letter misleads her, she is uncertain why she got the letter, but she also knows she is 50k in debt.  after a few minutes on the phone, she is explained the program in depth, finds out it can offer the assistance she has been looking for, and enrolls in the program, becoming debt free after the length of time she chose to enroll with.

            the lady is saved approximately 40-60% of her principle, is settled in full for 25k and after 2-3 years is completely debt free.

            my question to you damon is, do you think the lady felt that a few moments of being mislead was worth the outcome?

            what if i told you, damon, that i would give you 10 thousand dollars if you agreed to feel mislead for a few moments? would you do it?  i bet you would.  hell, id go as far as to say you would do it for a thousand dollars.  id do it for 50!

            the point is, damon, the letters, although misleading, SERVE A PURPOSE.  

            again, im not an employee.  i do not have a copy of a contract.

            also, i do not specifically know the difference between debt mediation and debt settlement.  i cant imagine why that would be relevant information, though.  i do know that what CRA does is debt settlement.  if the word mediation is used on their website, they must intend it to have similar meaning. (im assuming)

            to be honest damon, it really just seems like you’re trying to go tit for tat now, the whole reason i initially posted was because i wanted people to know that it simply is NOT A SCAM.  i posted because the first entry i saw said ‘definitely a scam’.  then i read on 
            as more ‘uninformed’ people rallied together on a bashing party.

            a family friend of mine was over 40k in debt.  she was enrolled into the program and ended up debt free after 2 years, and paid only 24 thousand dollars TOTAL.  this includes the fees from CRA.  does this sound unreasonable?  she was brought to tears when explaining to me how they helped her.  she showed me the letter and encouraged me to call to help out with my debt problem.  

            when i called in, i got all the information i possibly could.  that is where the bulk of my facts come from, along with some online fact checking done before these posts.  i was unable to enroll in the program because my entire debt load was less than 7500 dollars.  they only accept those with debt loads above 7500.

            the company is not a ‘scam’.  plain and simple.  

            thanks for reading.

          • Wow, that sure was a big mouthful for someone that supposedly doesn’t work for or have any financial ties to this company. So you know all this about this company just from a sales call and some online research huh? Funny, my online research tells a much different story.

            Maybe I should have clarified the name change raises a red flag comment.

            How about if a debt settlement company known for charging high upfront fees and having a very low success rate, multiple attorneys general inquiries and actions, an F BBB rating with 159 complaints, problems with deceptive advertising, angry customers popping up all over, and an online reputation that only a mother could love, suddenly changes its name, It is a red flag.

            If this is actually their guarantee then the only thing that comes to my mind is what a croc of sh**. You are supposed to settle the debt and your guarantee only kicks in if a client actually has to pay back more than they owe in the first place? Wow, this makes me feel all warm and cozy. You guys seem very confident in your abilities.

            Half Truths – like the company works wonders or the company has repaired over 200 million dollars for consumers (whatever that means). 

            Um, did you just say:

            I agree that the mailer is deceptive, the purpose of the company however is to not mislead people, but the marketing department has one job, to get the phones to ring. 

            So what you are saying is that the company purposely misleads people to get the phones to ring, but it is not their purpose to mislead people? Further how would you know what the purpose of this company is since you have never worked there but only called in for a chat with the sales guy who I am thinking wouldn’t be the most forthcoming about any company short falls. 

            If you are asking me if tricking someone into thinking they are calling into a government program just to get them on the phone under the guise that this is a government sponsored debt relief program and then having an “ignorant” (your word right?) sales person sell them a debt settlement program under the guise of offering a financial consultation is ok, the answer is, it certainly is not ok and the fact that you think it is exposes a huge problem in this industry.

            Again you have not seen the financials of this company, how do you know how many people they have helped vs the ones that paid fees and didn’t get the promised help? 

            Let me give you an example of a half truth that will make it clear what these debt settlement companies do every day. Bernie Maddoff was a genius and helped so many people get rich. He is awesome I don’t know why anyone would say anything bad about him. 

            Tell me what is wrong with that statement and you will figure out what is wrong with yours.

          • Wow Damon. I’m surprised by you. Turns out ladies and gentleman that Damon is actually self employed as a personal debt consultant. He has his list of trusted debt settlement companies that he can refer you to for a discount. Clearly you will get kickbacks from these companies for the referrals. It sounds to me that you’re just selling against the competition.

            And consider this:

            His two afilliate companies
            New era debt solutions, and Donaldson Williams BOTH charge higher fees than CRA. 17% for new era and and 15% from Donaldson.
            Oh and that’s right, new era used to be called DTS! They changed their name? How shady right Damon?

            And BBB?? Ha please. BBB is not consumer driven and you know it. Ratings are based on how much money the company throws at their LOCAL organization. CRA clearly doesn’t pay off their local BBB.

            Unhappy customers? What business do you know that works with so many people had zero unhappy customers? You can’t please everyone and when you cant it doesn’t make them a bad company.

            I don’t think you’re a bad guy Damon. I admire that you are passionate about your work, which is helping people, but I would have expected you of all people not to badmouth the competition simply because of a few stray marks. Your Trusted DS companies aren’t perfect either, I have read several complaints on both of them as well.

            You make money off of the people you help too. You should be advocating the industry And focusing on letting people know that there are many helpful companies, not just the 2 that pay you, instead of wasting time trying to sting others.

          • So Sad, yet So predictable. 

            You act as if you discovered some secret that I am a financial consultant. Uh, my name in every single comment links to my website that tells everyone exactly what I do.

            I appreciate the fact that you took a look at my website and have rolled out the red carpet for me to explain why every single consumer should call me before they call a debt settlement company.

            If you are going to read my website and presume to know how my business works, I would advise you to actually spend a little more time and get the details and then you would not have to remove your foot from your mouth in such a public setting.

            1. I do not get kickbacks from New Era or Donaldson Williams for referring clients to them during a phone consultation. Instead what I do is ask those companies to pass the referral fee on to my client in the form of a discount off their fees. (ouch didn’t see that coming did you Ahart)

            2. New Era’s fees are not higher than Credit Answers when you factor in the discount that my clients will get.

            3. Donaldson Williams charges 17% of what they SAVE A CLIENT, NOT OF THE TOTAL DEBT, so their fees will be about half. (oops, here is a towel for the egg on your face). With my discount the fee is even lower.

            4. I don’t tell people to sign up with them, I simply recommend that they be among the companies that are shopped if in fact they feel the need to hire a debt settlement company. I don’t work for them. I work for my clients.

            More often than not, I tell my clients what they need to know to resolve their debt on their own, but if they would like to hire someone, than those are two companies that look out for consumers and should be among the ones researched. I don’t mind at all if they compare my recommendations to Credit Answers or any other company. It isn’t my decision. My job is to give them the best information based on my knowledge and experience. 

            5. Unhappy customers? How do you reconcile the fact that credit answers was charging most of their fees upfront when a majority of the clients were not achieving the promised result? The problem is not the BBB. The problem is your business model. If you would like to discuss why Credit Answers was running a scam front loaded fee structure until the FTC forced them to stop, I would love to hear your thoughts on how this was a good thing for consumers.

            6. Neither New Era or Donaldson Williams front loaded their fees, even before there was a law, they were doing things in favor of their clients even at a time when the industry was just out right ripping people off. That shows something about the character of the business owners. To me, character matters, and I am sure it matters to consumers as well. I think they might want to know about companies that didn’t rip them off even when it wasn’t illegal.

            7. I am not in competition with any debt settlement company. I am poking holes in your  “Credit Resolution Advisors is a great company theory” because quite frankly, calling consumers ignorant when I know what this company has been doing to them for years just really pissed me off. 

            Notice on my website it says “Honest Programs I trust.” Instead of dodging, please explain why I should tell a consumer to trust a company that admittedly misleads them to get their phones ringing, and ran a bogus front loaded fee program that was designed to maximize profit regardless of how bad it hurt most of their clients? Please give me a reason why I should tell people that this is a good company?

            8. I do make money by helping consumers. They pay me directly and I work for them, which is a nice breath of fresh air. To think they can actually have an advocate looking out for them for a change and helping them figure out how to resolve their situation without stuffing some sales pitch down their throat for a one size fits all debt settlement plan they probably don’t need. And by learning the truth they get to save thousands of dollars and actually get a plan designed for them that takes into account all of their unique life circumstances. How great is that?

            If any consumer reading this would like an actual consultation from someone that is in business to tell you the truth vs sell you a program feel free to contact me at DamonDay.com

            Now Ahart, how about an answer to my Bernie Madoff question please? Why would he not be considered a good guy even though he made a lot of people rich?

          • You sure are reaching Damon!  As I visualize us here going back and forth in this public setting, I see myself calmly telling an experience I have had as a consumer, and I see you as a red faced ‘pissed’ off spinster who is running out of things to throw at me.  (As if I deserved any of them.)

            You have resorted to saying ‘croc of shit’, ‘foot in your mouth’, and ‘egg on your face’.  That’s just great, it sounds to me like you’re getting personal, and its clear that anyone resorting to such is clearly running out of sound arguments.

            The reasons that I highlighted your profession are this:

            The companies you are affiliated with operate similarly to CRA.  One has even had a name change, which many including you have made such a fuss about.
            Your affiliate companies charge high fees, with or without your referrals, just like any other.

            This is the main FACT:  by being affiliated with those companies, you have INCENTIVE to badmouth the ones that you do not work with.

            This fact cannot be rebutted.  It is what it is.

            If there is one thing that is getting annoying, it is how you repeatedly imply that I am an employee or representative of the company.  I have posted my testimony as a CONSUMER.  That is all.  Nothing you say or do can change the experience I have had.  It has already happened.  

            Even after I have repeatedly told you that I don’t work for CRA, you still try associate me with them.  You have said ‘your sales manager’, ‘your company’, and ‘your sales model’.  You even drew a completely false conclusion and got caught up in your own rubbish by saying :

            “Instead of dodging, please explain why I should tell a consumer to trust a company that admittedly misleads them to get their phones ringing, ”

            When did the company admit this to you?  I SAID THIS.  I am not the company.  This is my opinion of their marketing department and my explanation of the nature of the letters, which is the main hooplah of this thread.  Let me make it clear again I’M NOT AN EMPLOYEE.  YOU REPEATEDLY ASSOCIATE ME WITH THEM TO DEBASE MY TESTIMONY.  In telling you what I think about the marketing program, it is honestly me conceding the point to you, just like I have conceded with the ‘ignorant’ statement.

            What I don’t understand is this.  You want to poke holes in my “CRA is a great company theory”.  That’s fine, you have poked holes, in some ways I have agreed and in some ways I have not.  I am not here to proclaim that CRA is 100% perfect in way, but you strangely seem to argue the flipside, that they are unethical, a scam, and operate illegally.  It seems so strange to me that you concede nothing, even after hearing my experience.  I understand that you have your experiences, I recognize that.  But you in no way recognize my experiences and resort to attempting to make me look stupid for telling this forum the experiences that I’ve had.  What gives you the right?  That is precisely what this forum is for, and by being so sure of yourself that all you know is right and all I know is wrong, it makes me think you have an ulterior motive.  Again, your position creates incentive for you to badmouth other companies you do not work with.  
            If you ever convince me that CRA is a scam, then you have also convinced me that you and everyone else in the industry is as well.  You all operate in a similar way.  Your whole website is a sales pitch just like the ones you despise from CRA.  Personally, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with a sales pitch, but you seem to have a problem with the fact that CRA has one.  Donaldson’s website,(your affiliate), has a sales pitch as well.  It is ‘we don’t need a sales pitch’.  That’s a sales pitch.  

            You tell me that I haven’t seen the company financials and ask how I can say that more people are helped than not.

            Have you seen the financials?  What proof do you have that allows you to blatantly say that the ‘majority’ of customers are not helped?

            You can sit here and spin things any way you like but the simple fact remains.  My experience of the company is that they are a good, legitimate company, who did exactly what they said they would for a friend of mine.  You won’t seem to recognize that.  Why? 

            And by the way, your Bernie Madoff analogy is just silly.  They don’t correlate.  Bernie Madoff broke the law.  He went to jail.  What he did was illegal.

            CRA doesn’t break the law, the executives were not sent to jail, and they do not operate illegally.  It doesn’t make any sense to correlate the two, so you didn’t “get me”, the way you were so sure you were going to.

          • Well, alrighty then. Consumers can read this thread, get my point of view, get yours, do some quick google searches on Credit Answers and then decide whether or not they would like to hire them.

            I am fine with that 🙂

      • Sounds like you should knock off your crap and leave people alone.  All of your posts are extremely transparent.  You are a parasite.

      •  You are so full of shit.  Now either this IS a one person scam and you haven’t managed to attach your leech-like self to anyone and have a great deal of spare time OR you were paid by the company OR are employed by the company – it really doesn’t matter.  The point is, this is a scam.  You are deliberately targeting the elderly and/or the naive to frighten them by threatening with debt they do not have.  This particular attempt, targeted at my father, was sent to my house.  So, you don’t even have accurate information.

        Rather than spend your time attempting to defend this repugnant scam, I would suggest you find a legitimate venture.

        • he’s right, your the windbag…definition of windbag empty full of air, no real thoughts ideas or concerns, shit talking without solid factual information. Just like your head empty and like the reply you made to someone who actually is more knowledgeable than you. Ignorant people like you are the reason why people in the east laugh at us everyday… CRadvisors, is a legit business which actually cleans up the mess that banks and financial institutions make with their bad accounts, their abusive interest rates, and their minimum payments that are designed to maximize profitability on your accounts and keep you in debt for 30 years while they brain wash you into thinking that making your payments is giving you good credit and keeping you happy thinking that. when the truth is your financially fucked and drowning without even knowing it. the real scam here are the bank’s credit card agreements and terms.

          • Oh right. Legitimate businesses send out SCAM MAIL to people with BULLSHIT LIES on them. Really. You’re an idiot. Here’s a fact: real credit counseling agencies don’t use underhanded techniques to get business. I’m not brainwashed, thanks. I don’t have any credit card debt: I pay my debts and didn’t make the silly mistakes that I’ve seen other people make. So your assumptions based on NOTHING are idiotic…as usual. I’m going on FACTS. I’ve received the SCAM JUNK MAIL from this “business” with false information that I supposedly owe $15K and should start sending them $335 a month. THEY ARE A SCAM. You can sit and bitch about my telling the truth all fucking day, I couldn’t care less. Fuck off.

          • Just an FYI, pointing to the bad behavior by banks to justify the bad behavior of CRA is a little absurd don’t you think?

            Banks are taking advantage of people, and even worse in my opinion, debt relief companies are taking advantage of people that have already been taken advantage of, under the false pretense of offering help.
            Companies like CRA do not clean up the mess, they usually just make it larger.

          • what a liar you are! CR ADvisors finally stopped sending me BILLS FOR DEBT I DON’T HAVE after I threatened them with legal action. THEY DON’T HELP PEOPLE. THEY SCAM THEM. Go fuck yourself, you irrelevant douchebag. Geek? The only type of geek you are is the type that bites heads off chickens, because you have exactly ZERO credibility when it comes to this flybynight bullshit business. Which is exactly why the asshole douchebag CEO was lost his accreditation! Maybe if you actually did your fucking homework, you wouldn’t sound like such a windsucking asshole. Oh, but you do. Seriously stupid: fuck off with your LIES.

  57. Definitely a scam. I have no debt yet received a “Second Notice” letter when there was never a first. Talk about a poorly planned scam. I think maybe I should use my black hat skills and pay their system(s) a visit so that all the information they have is redirected to a certain 3 letter gov’t. agency.

  58. I just got a letter to and googled it to see what it was about, that’s how I found this here.  I am so glad I did, if anyone figures out how to opt out of ever hearing from them let me know! Thanks!

  59. I have never been talked to like the rude customer service rep talked to me. He would not let me talk and called me “queen credit” and proceeded to try and “sell” his service. I asked him to take my name off the mailing list several times and he still proceeded to ignore my request and call me queen credit…horrible customer service!

    • The question which must be asked is- why did you speak with anyone from such a scam company?  A bit of advise from someone who works in finance – NEVER, EVER consider doing business with any company which contacts you via telephone or mail.  The low life scums are below contempt.  

      As a nice little action, I write “return to sender” and drop such mailings in the mail box outside my office.  If they call I sometimes get someone on the phone and then  walk away.  I never really know how much time they spend before the realize no one is listening.

  60. Amazing to me how you tell people that you will not hurt their credit. That is so not true. Shame on you. The one thing is if you have taken personal information and the client decides not to do you program. It should be easy to get out of immediately. No questions asked. If this is a scam believe me the Better Business Bureau will be notified.

    • better business bureau is paid by companies to be on their good list. It’s a form of advertising themselves. Not helpful to the consumer

      • true that, better business bureau is pretty much all paid by companys so that they dont get targetted by governments pretty much

  61. OMG I am so glad I cam across your site. I get letters from
    Credit Resolution Advisors every couple months. Now I wanted to check them out more and glad I did.
    My shredder is going to be happy.



  62. I was so mad after receiving their “final notice,” I called them, and told them to please stop sending me this, as I don’t have any credit card balances like the ones they are suggesting. Unless, they are buying up information about my student loans, which I suspect….

    • They are just fishing.  They have no idea about your debt until they pull if from the credit bureaus.  It’s all a scam.

  63. Am constantly receiving mail from them advising they can help with my “debt” except I have no debt.  They have my name, a supposed account number, approximate amount of debt I owe, etc.  After reading the comments I can assure you it’s a SCAM

  64. So glad I checked here.  These people have been bugging me for months now, won’t take no for an answer and refuse to identify the name of their company when directly asked.  I guess after reading the rest of the posts here, I can understand why.

  65. Anyone able to inform us of who owns this company and their address or the addresses of their family members would do a public service to post same here. These scum should be made to pay with threats to the security of their OWN family–if not direct retaliation. Making money this way should be grounds for deportation or a re-education camp regime until basic decency is instilled.

    • Please don’t throw away your letters or pink slips.  They will be proof of the scam or unlawful misrepresentation when a class action lawsuit is awarded. 

  66. Steve,

    Insider here, and it’s absolutely the same firm at the same old location. They have that address to throw people off, and I heard the top rep made $150k last yr.! To confirm just compare the careers tab on both sites and you’ll see they are the same. It;s common for DS firms to do this swith-a-roo.

    • Interesting. I notice that Credit Resolution Advisors is also located in Plano, Texas but at a different address than Credit Arbitrators and Credit Answers. 

      They described themselves as “CreditResolution Advisors, LLC is a premier debt settlement company”

      Credit Resolution Advisors
      6860 Dallas Pkwy
      Suite 200
      Plano, Texas 75024


      They also go by CreditResolution Advisors, just like CreditArbitrators and CreditAnswers. 

      I also see where they are running a help wanted ad in which they say their top sales people make $100,000. 

      Can anyone else confirm they may be related to or the same company?


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