“Dear Steve,
Leading Edge Recovery Solutions is the CA that bought my Sears account. They offered to settle for $867 but I do not have the money. They now offered to set up 12 monthly payments of $123. I do not have a problem paying since this is my debt. The only problem is that they want my bank account or debit card info. I will not give them my husband’s and my joint bank account info, but I do have a checking account I opened about a year ago, but I never use. I was planning on depositing only the payment amount each month to cover this settlement. This account does not have overdraft protection so they can’t over charge or charge multiple times. My bank will not pay it.
Do you think my bank account will be safe if I choose to pay with this debit card. It is not linked to my husband’s and my checking account that we do use and have payroll direct deposit.
Nancy”
Dear Nancy,
I think that sounds like a grand idea and one that minimizes your exposure. In fact I’d have to say your approach is brilliant and should be a great solution.
Please post your responses and follow-up messages to me on this in the comments section below.
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Thanks.
Well I’d point that out to the rep and offer to send it back to her to see.
Yes, it says the last day of the month.
Does the email you got say what day the payments are due on?
Yes, I do. It was sent through email. She did tell me that the $900 settlement was just an offer, but I could continue giving monthly payments. Last night I gave my payment, and she says, “Next payment is due on the 31st of the month. So why did she tell me the 25th two days ago? I just want to give my monthly payment without them calling me every month days before it’s due. After I gave the payment, she did say she could be calling me again before the 31st of next month.
Do you have that agreement in writing?
Steve, I got a call from Leading Edge yesterday on my cell phone at work. They were offering a $900 settlement to close this account. I told them all I could do was give the payments we had already agreed on. Then the person says I have payment due. I told her that as per our agreement my payment isnn’t due until the last day of each month. She said that my payment is due on the 25th. I told her that that’s not what my agreement says. She still insisted it was due on the 25th. Then I told her I would call back after 3:30 to give the payment, but I had left the credit card at home and wasn’t able to. Today she calls again and says that I need to give a payment. I told her that my payment isn’d due yet, but she said that that’s not the way it works. She says that I had told her the day before I was going to give the payment, and her client expects the payment now. I don’t want to be harrassed like this every month; I plan on giving each montly payment as stated on the agreement. It depresses me each time they call. What can I do?
You can always ask but I seriously doubt they will remove it. To begin to rebuild it you need to close the door on the bad stuff and let time pass. If you want to rebuild it faster, read this. Same rules apply.
Steve, My credit scores according to transunions, Truecredit are 679(TU), 669(EXP), and 678 (EQ). I thought that once you get a CO your credit scores tank. Are these very bad scores? Aside from these 2 chargeoff, most everything else has good payment history. I do have 1 late on my mortgage from 6 months age. Can I still expect my credit scores to go continue going down, or has the most damage to my scores been done.
The late on the mortgage was because I pay through my bank. I set up the payment on the 28th of the month, but the payment wasn’t credited until the 1st of the next month making it 30 days late. What are my chances of getting it removed? In 13 years with the same mortgage company, it is the only time I have ever been late.
Thanks
The amount you pay will show as paid in full but the amount forgiven will be shown as a bad debt.
Be nice and it is unlikely they will pursue it further at this time.
Thanks. I will do that. How likely are they to sue for $856 within the next few months. I can probably come up with the money in 3 months by working extra hours and babysitting on weekends, and offer a lump sum settlement to be reported “paid in full” Their settlement letter said it would be reported “paid in full.”
They probably got your cell number because you called their 800 number from your cell phone and they captured your number that way. It’s a trick with toll-free numbers.
You could send them a cease & desist letter to shut them up but that just leaves them communicating with you through the courts.
Frankly I’d by time by making the collector your friend. Just be nice, cordial, thank them for calling but stand your ground that you want to pay but can’t till you finish this other arrangement. As soon as that is finished you will gladly make payments.
No sense to get adversarial since it is what it is.
Thanks Steve, I called Sherman Financial and they confirmed that Leading Edge is their contracted collector. Also, I asked for my balance and it does show that my 1st payment was applied. I checked my credit report, but they are not reporting on my credit report. Only the original creditor byline shows.
I have another cc that was also charged off. Amount owed was $856. I just started receiving phone calls from them asking for payment (3 @ $214) or settlement ($521). They call me to my cell phone number; how they got the number I don’t know. I do want to pay them, but not until I finish paying Leading Edge. I can’t afford to be paying on 2 accounts with other bills I already have. I don’t want to commit to a payment or settlement and not be able to pay. I wanted to save for a couple of months and then offer a settlement. What can I do to stop their calls? How can I get them to wait?
Nancy,
No worries, just post follow-up questions regarding this issue in the comments section of your original question.
1. Pull a copy of your consolidated credit report and see who is currently reporting the debt. That’s the best way to see who is collecting for the debt at this time. There is no easy way to discern between ownership and collecting as an agent. Doesn’t really matter though. A third party acting as an agent is an extension of the owner.
2. The debit card idea in your case is a great idea because the exposure on the card was only what you would place in that account each month to pay.
3. If you made the first payment using your debit card then just make sure it shows you paid on the statement or logon to check your account. All you need is proof you paid in case they screw up the application of funds.
Stop worrying. It all sounds in order and moving along smoothly. I don’t see anything else you can do at the moment. Keep making the payments and just watch for proof they debited the account. If an issue arises in the future over payments you’ll have the proof.
Steve
Steve: Sorry I keep asking so many questions but I want to be as informed as possible. This is a continuation of yesterday’s post. Hope you remember who this is. I have 3 concerns:
1. I googled Leading Edge and Sherman Financial, and there are numerous complaints and lawsuits against them. So I’m very worried. Sears said that Sherman Financial bought the debt, Leading Edge says Resurgent owns the debt, the letter I received on Jan 18 from Leading Edge says the creditor is LVNV Funding. When I googled Sherman, it showed them as using Sherman, Resurgent, and LVNV as names. This is very confusing to me. I never validated the debt with Leading Edge to ensure they are legally allowed to collect the debt. I’m still within the 30 days allowed. Can I still validate or does the fact that I have given a payment prevent me from validating? I’m notdisputing the debt. I just don’t want to pay all this money and then be told I still owe Sherman.
2) You said that paying with my personal debit card was a great idea. Most websites I looked at say never use your debit or checking account. This debit card has no overdraft privilages and I would only deposit the exact amount to cover the payment. After I give the last payment, I would then close this account. Do you still think it’s safe? I also have a Walmart Moneycard Visa which i used to give the 1st payment. I can keep track of all activities on this card through their website.
Do I still use my debit?
3. I have not received any payment confirmation from Leading Edge for the 1st payment. All I have is the activity report from walmart since I used the Moneycard Visa. It shows a debit transaction of $123 from Leading Edge on Jan 31. Leading Edge credit manager said I would be mailed a statement next week. Another rep I spoke to yesterday said they don’t send statements. I’m already being lied to so I’m worried. Is the activity report from the Walmart website enough proof of 1st payment?
Could you please reply to all 3 concerns. I totally trust your advice. Thanks.
Steve: Sorry I keep asking so many questions but I want to be as informed as possible. This is a continuation of yesterday’s post. Hope you remember who this is. I have 3 concerns:
1. I googled Leading Edge and Sherman Financial, and there are numerous complaints and lawsuits against them. So I’m very worried. Sears said that Sherman Financial bought the debt, Leading Edge says Resurgent owns the debt, the letter I received on Jan 18 from Leading Edge says the creditor is LVNV Funding. When I googled Sherman, it showed them as using Sherman, Resurgent, and LVNV as names. This is very confusing to me. I never validated the debt with Leading Edge to ensure they are legally allowed to collect the debt. I’m still within the 30 days allowed. Can I still validate or does the fact that I have given a payment prevent me from validating? I’m notdisputing the debt. I just don’t want to pay all this money and then be told I still owe Sherman.
2) You said that paying with my personal debit card was a great idea. Most websites I looked at say never use your debit or checking account. This debit card has no overdraft privilages and I would only deposit the exact amount to cover the payment. After I give the last payment, I would then close this account. Do you still think it’s safe? I also have a Walmart Moneycard Visa which i used to give the 1st payment. I can keep track of all activities on this card through their website.
Do I still use my debit?
3. I have not received any payment confirmation from Leading Edge for the 1st payment. All I have is the activity report from walmart since I used the Moneycard Visa. It shows a debit transaction of $123 from Leading Edge on Jan 31. Leading Edge credit manager said I would be mailed a statement next week. Another rep I spoke to yesterday said they don’t send statements. I’m already being lied to so I’m worried. Is the activity report from the Walmart website enough proof of 1st payment?
Could you please reply to all 3 concerns. I totally trust your advice. Thanks.
Nancy,
No worries, just post follow-up questions regarding this issue in the comments section of your original question.
1. Pull a copy of your consolidated credit report and see who is currently reporting the debt. That’s the best way to see who is collecting for the debt at this time. There is no easy way to discern between ownership and collecting as an agent. Doesn’t really matter though. A third party acting as an agent is an extension of the owner.
2. The debit card idea in your case is a great idea because the exposure on the card was only what you would place in that account each month to pay.
3. If you made the first payment using your debit card then just make sure it shows you paid on the statement or logon to check your account. All you need is proof you paid in case they screw up the application of funds.
Stop worrying. It all sounds in order and moving along smoothly. I don’t see anything else you can do at the moment. Keep making the payments and just watch for proof they debited the account. If an issue arises in the future over payments you’ll have the proof.
Steve
Thanks Steve, I called Sherman Financial and they confirmed that Leading Edge is their contracted collector. Also, I asked for my balance and it does show that my 1st payment was applied. I checked my credit report, but they are not reporting on my credit report. Only the original creditor byline shows.
I have another cc that was also charged off. Amount owed was $856. I just started receiving phone calls from them asking for payment (3 @ $214) or settlement ($521). They call me to my cell phone number; how they got the number I don’t know. I do want to pay them, but not until I finish paying Leading Edge. I can’t afford to be paying on 2 accounts with other bills I already have. I don’t want to commit to a payment or settlement and not be able to pay. I wanted to save for a couple of months and then offer a settlement. What can I do to stop their calls? How can I get them to wait?
They probably got your cell number because you called their 800 number from your cell phone and they captured your number that way. It’s a trick with toll-free numbers.
You could send them a cease & desist letter to shut them up but that just leaves them communicating with you through the courts.
Frankly I’d by time by making the collector your friend. Just be nice, cordial, thank them for calling but stand your ground that you want to pay but can’t till you finish this other arrangement. As soon as that is finished you will gladly make payments.
No sense to get adversarial since it is what it is.
Thanks. I will do that. How likely are they to sue for $856 within the next few months. I can probably come up with the money in 3 months by working extra hours and babysitting on weekends, and offer a lump sum settlement to be reported “paid in full” Their settlement letter said it would be reported “paid in full.”
The amount you pay will show as paid in full but the amount forgiven will be shown as a bad debt.
Be nice and it is unlikely they will pursue it further at this time.
Thanks
Steve, My credit scores according to transunions, Truecredit are 679(TU), 669(EXP), and 678 (EQ). I thought that once you get a CO your credit scores tank. Are these very bad scores? Aside from these 2 chargeoff, most everything else has good payment history. I do have 1 late on my mortgage from 6 months age. Can I still expect my credit scores to go continue going down, or has the most damage to my scores been done.
The late on the mortgage was because I pay through my bank. I set up the payment on the 28th of the month, but the payment wasn’t credited until the 1st of the next month making it 30 days late. What are my chances of getting it removed? In 13 years with the same mortgage company, it is the only time I have ever been late.
You can always ask but I seriously doubt they will remove it. To begin to rebuild it you need to close the door on the bad stuff and let time pass. If you want to rebuild it faster, read this. Same rules apply.
Steve, I got a call from Leading Edge yesterday on my cell phone at work. They were offering a $900 settlement to close this account. I told them all I could do was give the payments we had already agreed on. Then the person says I have payment due. I told her that as per our agreement my payment isnn’t due until the last day of each month. She said that my payment is due on the 25th. I told her that that’s not what my agreement says. She still insisted it was due on the 25th. Then I told her I would call back after 3:30 to give the payment, but I had left the credit card at home and wasn’t able to. Today she calls again and says that I need to give a payment. I told her that my payment isn’d due yet, but she said that that’s not the way it works. She says that I had told her the day before I was going to give the payment, and her client expects the payment now. I don’t want to be harrassed like this every month; I plan on giving each montly payment as stated on the agreement. It depresses me each time they call. What can I do?
Do you have that agreement in writing?
Yes, I do. It was sent through email. She did tell me that the $900 settlement was just an offer, but I could continue giving monthly payments. Last night I gave my payment, and she says, “Next payment is due on the 31st of the month. So why did she tell me the 25th two days ago? I just want to give my monthly payment without them calling me every month days before it’s due. After I gave the payment, she did say she could be calling me again before the 31st of next month.
Does the email you got say what day the payments are due on?
Yes, it says the last day of the month.
Well I’d point that out to the rep and offer to send it back to her to see.
Thanks.
Last question for now. If I have more I’ll go ahead and start a new thread and give another donation. I have been reading a lot about debt validation. I never did this. Their 1st letter is dated January 18, 2011 so I’m still withing the 30 days. Is it too late for me to validate since I’ve already given the 1st payment? I don’t dispute the debt; I just want to make sure that Leading Edge is in fact authorized to collect for Sherman Financial. Like I stated above, when I called Sears they said Sherman Financial bought the account, but the letter from Leading Edge lists the creditor as LVNV Funding LLC. I just want to make sure I’m paying the right company. Thanks again, Steve.
No.
Sears informed me that my debt was sold to Sherman Financial also knows as Resurgent Capital. That’s the same company that Leading Edge told me owes the account. Leading Edge is doing the collecting for them. Are you familiar with any of these companies?
Thank you Steve. You’ve definiely brought me peace of mind.
Nancy,
If you are paying the full amount then there is not much to worry about except for the small residual balance at the end. The easy way to tell if the agreement is moving along smoothly is to ask them each month for a current balance. It should be marching downward as you. That should give you some peace of mind.
Steve
Sorry Steve. Right now I’m paying monthly payments on the full amount. I mentioned the $946 because that is what they had originally offered in a settlement. I couldn’t come up with the $946 at the time so we then went to a payment arrangement.
I was just wondering if they would accept going back to the original settlement offer of $946 or should I continue giving monthly payments on the full amount?
Another concern I had about the payment arrangement was the fact that it was emailed to me. I was reading online that emailed offers are not valid; they need to be sent by mail and signed. Would I be protected once I make the 12 monthly payments through my bank and keep my statements as proof of payments. I truly appreciate all your help and advice.
Nancy,
You said you were paying the full amount owed but it appears the amount you are paying is the settlement amount and not the full balance of $1,396.15.
So which is it? Are you paying a total of $946 or $1396? You’ve said both and now I’m confused.
So you don’t think they’re lying to me about the interest rate being 6% and no fees being acrued. Do they have to provide me the interest rate in writing if i ask for it? Most of the things the credit manager says is just verbal none of this is in writing. I was thinking of just going back and offering to go back to the original settlement. This letter did sount more legite.
RE: LVNV Funding LLC / CITIBANK
Account Number: ************xxxx
LERS Account Number: xxxxxxxxx
Current Balance: $1,396.15
Settlement Amount: $946.00
Dear Nancy ,
This letter serves as confirmation that Leading Edge Recovery Solutions will accept $946.00 as a full and final settlement on the above referenced account.
Once the settlement amount has been received and the funds have cleared for payment, you will then be released of any further liability to LVNV Funding LLC / CITIBANK, and its agents in reference to this account. In return, we will then notify our client the account has been settled in full and that your credit bureau should be updated accordingly.
I already paid 123.35 so I could offer them $800 more to settle. I think i can borrow from relatives and pay them the 123.35 and be done in about 6 monthes. Do you think they would go for reconsidering the settlement or do you suggest I just continue with the current payment plan? What would looke better on my credit report? If there’s any hope left of bettering my credit report.
OK, if that;s the case then your ability to provide proof you made the payments and they received them, like with your bank statement, will be all you need to show the debt is paid. There may be a small residual balance due at the end.
The debt will then reflect as paid but your credit history will still show the past negative history.
Seems all is good here.
They is no debt forgiven; I’m paying the full amount owed.
Spoke to credit manager this morning. He says that he cannot give me a written statement that says that the 12 payments will settle the account in full because his company is not the owner of the credit; they are the company hired to collect. He also explained that my interest is 6% so if their is interest it would be small. Is there a maximum interest they can charge in the state of Texas. They said they will send me a monthly statement stating my balance after each payment. Now I already gave my first payment. What can I do know? I had been feeling good about getting this debt paid, but now I’m stressing that they tricked me and I made a bad deal. What do you suggest I do now? Please help! I will be updating you often. I would greatly appreciate your help. I’m starting to get very depressed thinking I’ve been duped.
Glad you posted that. It reads like a trick. The letter does not say it will be in full satisfaction of your debt. In fact it specifically says there may be a remaining balance they will go after. The remaining balance may be fees and penalties the accrue during the repayment period.
The only problem with the money order approach is it can be difficult to prove they actually cash them if you have to prove you paid. Personally I thought your initial approach was better.
While they may report the account as paid, what they have not told you is they will report any part of the debt forgiven as a bad debt on the credit report.
One more thing I wanted to point out: the $123.35 for 12 months pays off the full amount owed which is $1396.15. So I wouldn’t have a remaining balance, right?
This is what the letter says:
January 25, 2011
(My Name and Address)
RE: CC Company
Account Number: ************XXXX
LERS Account Number: XXXXXXXXX
Current Balance: $1,396.15
Dear Nancy,
This letter serves as confirmation that Leading Edge Recovery Solutions will accept the
following payment arrangement on the above referenced account:
$123.35 due by 1/31/2011
$123.35 due by the last day of each month thereafter for 11 months
After the last payment is made, please contact us to discuss a resolution regarding the
remaining balance. This agreement is in effect through the last payment date outlined
above and is null and void if the terms of this agreement are not met.
Sincerely,
Collections Department
*I did question the fact that it says “please contact us to discuss a resolution regarding the remaining balance…” Credit manager said that this is a standard letter they send out, and that once the last payment was made that it would be reported “paid” to the credit bureau. I was worried since it doesn’t state this on the settlement letter, but I’ve already given the 1st payment. After the last payment, I’m not sending them anymore money. Instead of using my personal debit account, I sent them a money order and will continue to do so for the rest of the payments. I hope I made the right choice by having accepted this settlement offer as stated in the letter. Please advice me.
Does the settlement letter say that the amount you will pay fully satisfies the debt?
Thanks Angelo. They did email me a settlement letter that outlines each payment amount and due date.
Your bank account should be safe Nancy, but do not give any banking information until Leading Edge sends you a settlement letter outlining the agreed upon terms. Once the payment is satisfied follow up with a phone call and ask for a letter of satisfaction. Keep a copy for your records in case anyone ever tries to collect again and forward a copy to the 3 credit bureaus to update your report.
Your bank account should be safe Nancy, but do not give any banking information until Leading Edge sends you a settlement letter outlining the agreed upon terms. Once the payment is satisfied follow up with a phone call and ask for a letter of satisfaction. Keep a copy for your records in case anyone ever tries to collect again and forward a copy to the 3 credit bureaus to update your report.
Thanks Angelo. They did email me a settlement letter that outlines each payment amount and due date.
Does the settlement letter say that the amount you will pay fully satisfies the debt?
This is what the letter says:
January 25, 2011
(My Name and Address)
RE: CC Company
Account Number: ************XXXX
LERS Account Number: XXXXXXXXX
Current Balance: $1,396.15
Dear Nancy,
This letter serves as confirmation that Leading Edge Recovery Solutions will accept the
following payment arrangement on the above referenced account:
$123.35 due by 1/31/2011
$123.35 due by the last day of each month thereafter for 11 months
After the last payment is made, please contact us to discuss a resolution regarding the
remaining balance. This agreement is in effect through the last payment date outlined
above and is null and void if the terms of this agreement are not met.
Sincerely,
Collections Department
*I did question the fact that it says “please contact us to discuss a resolution regarding the remaining balance…” Credit manager said that this is a standard letter they send out, and that once the last payment was made that it would be reported “paid” to the credit bureau. I was worried since it doesn’t state this on the settlement letter, but I’ve already given the 1st payment. After the last payment, I’m not sending them anymore money. Instead of using my personal debit account, I sent them a money order and will continue to do so for the rest of the payments. I hope I made the right choice by having accepted this settlement offer as stated in the letter. Please advice me.
One more thing I wanted to point out: the $123.35 for 12 months pays off the full amount owed which is $1396.15. So I wouldn’t have a remaining balance, right?
Glad you posted that. It reads like a trick. The letter does not say it will be in full satisfaction of your debt. In fact it specifically says there may be a remaining balance they will go after. The remaining balance may be fees and penalties the accrue during the repayment period.
The only problem with the money order approach is it can be difficult to prove they actually cash them if you have to prove you paid. Personally I thought your initial approach was better.
While they may report the account as paid, what they have not told you is they will report any part of the debt forgiven as a bad debt on the credit report.
Spoke to credit manager this morning. He says that he cannot give me a written statement that says that the 12 payments will settle the account in full because his company is not the owner of the credit; they are the company hired to collect. He also explained that my interest is 6% so if their is interest it would be small. Is there a maximum interest they can charge in the state of Texas. They said they will send me a monthly statement stating my balance after each payment. Now I already gave my first payment. What can I do know? I had been feeling good about getting this debt paid, but now I’m stressing that they tricked me and I made a bad deal. What do you suggest I do now? Please help! I will be updating you often. I would greatly appreciate your help. I’m starting to get very depressed thinking I’ve been duped.
They is no debt forgiven; I’m paying the full amount owed.
OK, if that;s the case then your ability to provide proof you made the payments and they received them, like with your bank statement, will be all you need to show the debt is paid. There may be a small residual balance due at the end.
The debt will then reflect as paid but your credit history will still show the past negative history.
Seems all is good here.
So you don’t think they’re lying to me about the interest rate being 6% and no fees being acrued. Do they have to provide me the interest rate in writing if i ask for it? Most of the things the credit manager says is just verbal none of this is in writing. I was thinking of just going back and offering to go back to the original settlement. This letter did sount more legite.
RE: LVNV Funding LLC / CITIBANK
Account Number: ************xxxx
LERS Account Number: xxxxxxxxx
Current Balance: $1,396.15
Settlement Amount: $946.00
Dear Nancy ,
This letter serves as confirmation that Leading Edge Recovery Solutions will accept $946.00 as a full and final settlement on the above referenced account.
Once the settlement amount has been received and the funds have cleared for payment, you will then be released of any further liability to LVNV Funding LLC / CITIBANK, and its agents in reference to this account. In return, we will then notify our client the account has been settled in full and that your credit bureau should be updated accordingly.
I already paid 123.35 so I could offer them $800 more to settle. I think i can borrow from relatives and pay them the 123.35 and be done in about 6 monthes. Do you think they would go for reconsidering the settlement or do you suggest I just continue with the current payment plan? What would looke better on my credit report? If there’s any hope left of bettering my credit report.
Nancy,
You said you were paying the full amount owed but it appears the amount you are paying is the settlement amount and not the full balance of $1,396.15.
So which is it? Are you paying a total of $946 or $1396? You’ve said both and now I’m confused.
Sorry Steve. Right now I’m paying monthly payments on the full amount. I mentioned the $946 because that is what they had originally offered in a settlement. I couldn’t come up with the $946 at the time so we then went to a payment arrangement.
I was just wondering if they would accept going back to the original settlement offer of $946 or should I continue giving monthly payments on the full amount?
Another concern I had about the payment arrangement was the fact that it was emailed to me. I was reading online that emailed offers are not valid; they need to be sent by mail and signed. Would I be protected once I make the 12 monthly payments through my bank and keep my statements as proof of payments. I truly appreciate all your help and advice.
Nancy,
If you are paying the full amount then there is not much to worry about except for the small residual balance at the end. The easy way to tell if the agreement is moving along smoothly is to ask them each month for a current balance. It should be marching downward as you. That should give you some peace of mind.
Steve
Thank you Steve. You’ve definiely brought me peace of mind.
Sears informed me that my debt was sold to Sherman Financial also knows as Resurgent Capital. That’s the same company that Leading Edge told me owes the account. Leading Edge is doing the collecting for them. Are you familiar with any of these companies?
No.
Last question for now. If I have more I’ll go ahead and start a new thread and give another donation. I have been reading a lot about debt validation. I never did this. Their 1st letter is dated January 18, 2011 so I’m still withing the 30 days. Is it too late for me to validate since I’ve already given the 1st payment? I don’t dispute the debt; I just want to make sure that Leading Edge is in fact authorized to collect for Sherman Financial. Like I stated above, when I called Sears they said Sherman Financial bought the account, but the letter from Leading Edge lists the creditor as LVNV Funding LLC. I just want to make sure I’m paying the right company. Thanks again, Steve.